tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post6606183895165060491..comments2024-03-13T09:26:30.351-04:00Comments on PunkPatriot.com: Talking Points on Welfare #4The Punk Patriothttp://www.blogger.com/profile/02671149620207872986noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-56535426899297242982011-01-20T23:26:27.777-05:002011-01-20T23:26:27.777-05:00TiradeFaction: Yeah, Cato is a lobbying and PR gro...TiradeFaction: Yeah, Cato is a lobbying and PR group for wealthy and corporate interests. The Randroid's argument is basically the one that Mall-Wart makes, as it destroys the country.libhomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05537213558568338561noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-71728806347466404012011-01-13T22:34:13.015-05:002011-01-13T22:34:13.015-05:00Lol @ Cato. Could you try to use a source that isn...Lol @ Cato. Could you try to use a source that isn't so blatantly biased?TiradeFactionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06760660346802297769noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-80475560733526868152011-01-10T11:22:42.707-05:002011-01-10T11:22:42.707-05:00What history, statistics or rational do you have f...What history, statistics or rational do you have for the claim that price controls keep milk prices down? That ignores the (irrational and stupid) reasons that those laws were passed in the first place. Farmers didn't want milk prices to drop! If they did, they would lose money! That is why the controls were put in place! (This all ignores that the prices controls are a MINIMUM PRICE. not a maximum price! Milk could be as high as they wanted!)<br /><br />http://www.cato.org/pubs/tbb/tbb_0707_47.pdf<br /><br />The laws the protected dairy farmers in the 30's were passed and rationalized in the same manner the minimum wage law was: To protect non-innovators from innovators. (And I dare you to defend the inventors of the minimum wage ;) you should read up on it before you do so...)<br /> <br /><br />In every sector of the economy prices go down, except ones that are touched by government legislation. <br /><br />I agree that farmers whose products are subsidized could not make money without the subsidies. That just means there are too many farmers producing food inefficiently. Fewer farmers could produce more food, but the politically connected do not want to lose their big government checks to produce food as efficiently as 1940's farmers.<br /><br />And your statement about capitalism claiming there are winners and losers is a complete misrepresentation of what capitalism is. When trade is truly free, it is not a zero-sum game. The zero-sum game you are referring to is political power and government. That is where the true game of winners and losers are.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-36041162773121076412011-01-07T23:13:19.991-05:002011-01-07T23:13:19.991-05:00Uhm, anon. For some reason your post isn't sh...Uhm, anon. For some reason your post isn't showing up, but I got a notification in my inbox anyways.<br /><br />Anyways-- price controls keep the price of milk DOWN.<br />Without market regulation, dairies would form cabals and drive the price of milk through the roof. Which is exactly what they already do. Which is why we put price controls on the price of things like milk, cheese, wheat, etc.<br /><br />And since farmers who take part in these cabals can't make any money that way, we subsidize their cost of living.<br /> <br />Capitalism doesn't work like you think it does. It's not magic. If you just leave everything alone, things don't just "work themselves out." There are winners and losers. Like Lions eating gazelle on the savanna. The gazelle is the loser, the lion is the winner.<br /><br />America is a civilized society. That's why we have a government, and welfare, and regulation.The Punk Patriothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02671149620207872986noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-58186474811342531432011-01-07T16:24:12.240-05:002011-01-07T16:24:12.240-05:00Your use of milk as an example further illustrates...Your use of milk as an example further illustrates your ignorance. I agree milk is TOO EXPENSIVE. Milk's prices, by law, are kept high to protect politically connected farms. Those are price controls, not the free market. Food in general is controlled by the government through subsidies and price controls. So blame the government, not CEOs or whatever mythical thief you dream of. Anywhere where the free market can reign, prices are low and continue to go down.<br /><br />Your response still tells me you did not read the link I posted. He uses the same data you do. Once again, he uses the same data you do. <br /><br />Not only that, you posted this: http://macroblog.typepad.com/macroblog/2005/12/are_workers_los.html which negates the claim that we are being paid less. Real compensation is up,up,up... <br />"I'd argue the problem is that hourly wages or earnings are an inadequate measure of labor compensation, primarily because they exclude nonwage forms of compensation -- health care benefits, employers' share of social security contributions, and the like." So you didn't read all of this post either...<br /><br />I am sorry a degree in graphic design didn't come with training in economics or public policy.<br /><br /><br />@Russ:<br /><br />It is hard to take this post seriously in its entirety because he doesn't in anyway address the original "Taxation is theft" claim. <br />But your claim that the top 15% don't pay taxes is wrong. They pay more than 95% of the taxes in America. They may pay less as a percentage of their income, but your original claim is false as you state it and takes away from your argument...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-42561215365826464722011-01-07T04:10:51.239-05:002011-01-07T04:10:51.239-05:00@anon
Ok, let's do it your way, only using sta...@anon<br />Ok, let's do it your way, only using stats from a recognized source,U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics :<br /><br />Gallon of Milk<br />1964 .80 302.52 7.56 .1058 = 6.348 mins<br /><br />2011 4.00 898.00 22.45 .1782 = 10.692 mins<br /><br />Your claims go against established data from U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics, so sorry if we consider them the bunk they are.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02527154642163314078noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-83231595492534196902011-01-06T18:25:53.105-05:002011-01-06T18:25:53.105-05:00I'm only half with ya on this one. That top 1...I'm only half with ya on this one. That top 15%.... They don't actually pay taxes, that's a fraud maid up because they own the media they hide their money in corporate wrappers and over seas shell games. But they sure got a nice bail out with our tax money and I call that theft!<br /><br />So as far as I'm concerned taxation is theft. The only ones who got socialism right are very regressive societies and I gotta respect them for it. The Amish, The Indians, The Pacific Islanders, and other native style communities. All great and working forms of socialism without monetary systems until we forced our society onto them.Russhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06750711942908253293noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-33748965777156467192011-01-06T13:01:11.279-05:002011-01-06T13:01:11.279-05:00Clearly you didn't read what I posted and just...Clearly you didn't read what I posted and just simply re-posted the sources used by Mr. Punk. Those numbers you posted are not false! And if you read what I posted it confirms that. But you are, both, only looking at one side of the story. I will pose the same question that is in the page I posted: Does it matter if wages have gone down if the cost of everything has also gone down? The hours it takes one person to make enough to afford most things is WAY down and that represents the true cost of living.<br /><br />"The ultimate measure of the cost of consumption goods is the labor time needed to purchase them. A pair of pants might cost $20, but if the average industrial wage is $2/hr then those are more "expensive" than if the average industrial wage is $10/hr. Five times more expensive, we might add. When looked at this way, the real cost of living has dropped significantly and consistently over the course of the century and the last few decades." <br /><br />Again: the source: http://myslu.stlawu.edu/~shorwitz/Good/myths.htmAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-54587848800244013052011-01-06T03:10:20.893-05:002011-01-06T03:10:20.893-05:00@ anon
US worker productivity up, labor devalued ...@ anon<br /><br />US worker productivity up, labor devalued and at the same rate as in 1960, but cost of living has tripled. We can try to change this civilly together or we can start a revolution, but something has to change one way or another.<br /><br />(Source: U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics)-<br />http://www.workinglife.org/wiki/Wages+and+Benefits%3A+Real+Wages+%281964-2004%29<br /><br />http://20somethingfinance.com/american-hours-worked-productivity-vacation/<br /><br />(#'s derived from U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics)-<br />http://macroblog.typepad.com/macroblog/2005/12/are_workers_los.html<br /><br />(sources linked at bottom)<br />http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_Real_Wages_1964-2004.gifUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02527154642163314078noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-12417895023731830942011-01-03T14:26:16.958-05:002011-01-03T14:26:16.958-05:00I think in order to give a "history of econom...I think in order to give a "history of economics" as you put it, you should know something about economics. Everything you have said is half true. I hope you take the time to read this from an economist (the first part will be especially enlightening to you): http://myslu.stlawu.edu/~shorwitz/Good/myths.htm<br /><br />After reading that you will realize you are half correct about most of this, and entirely wrong about the theft part. When you have the freedom to spend your money as you want that is not theft... Theft IS taxation: you are put in jail if you do not pay, period. (but you do not even go into that.)<br /><br />Also is there any proof, beside your half-analysis of these statistics, that we are being eased into starvation? We are better off right now than we would have been at anytime in human history. You are richer than the richest man was 150 years ago.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5207550747227359267.post-56189701553502919962011-01-02T13:36:58.837-05:002011-01-02T13:36:58.837-05:00Once again, brilliant post.Once again, brilliant post.RGhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12264363264956622352noreply@blogger.com